Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

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AlanF5
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by AlanF5 » Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:55 pm

It'll drop off during the fight.
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kdonovan
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by kdonovan » Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:50 pm

Really? They keep annoying at me even after I wipe out the population.

Azrael Ultima
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Azrael Ultima » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:07 pm

Given their enormous travel time, those are probably leftover missiles from before you killed of the population.

I think they take longer than 30s to reach anything before micro-fusion.
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ForceUser
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ForceUser » Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:17 pm

All Hail DF Racks!

No seriously, I've never used them but just got ANY (Finally) and the Antiaquilar scenario start with decent tech (AI too)

I'm playing as liir and having some trouble but just with those pesky monkeys. The human ships are just soo fast and they took a colony out so I retaliated. At this time I have very little tech since I've been concentrating on econ. Going by stats it seems the DF Racks was the best I had and I didn't feel like using Gauss, lasers or canons since I'd have to build some more again after I research new tech etc. And I don't have AP rounds :) The design is Assault/armor/fusion with ALL slots DFs and the torps just normal plasma. I did get Poly armor and PD too so lucky me :)

I was a bit skeptical (usually build canons/AP but I built a few since I had too but only sent 1 to the enemy planet. It kicked so much ass before dieing, 1 CR CNC and 6+ Armor DEs and I managed to kill the CNC and an armor with just the 1 ship.

So I was, ok ok, that's cool but they will be sending proper CRs there now so I managed to scrape 3 together and a little DE CNC. When I got there I faced some mop up DEs and sats. Then next turn BAM 5 CRs with a CR CNC.

I'm used to slugging it out a little and then seeing all my liir ships make pretty fireworks. Luckily the enemy went missile so that helped :) but they had strafe with canons and I was pretty sure I was going to loose them. I had just researched fusion warheads so I thought, what the heck. They demolished the ennemy soo bad. I did use the liir agility to dance them around but you cant really dodge lasers and even most canons hit. I'd first target the CNC and it would blow up before it got to me (2x torps per CR is pretty badass) and then a nice hairy furball and they would pop one by one. Even if the DFs would miss a LOT they were still mowing the guys down like crazy :)

I only had one repair CR there so I was worried I'd slowly loose the ships to mounting damage but it was more than enough to repair all the damage. I'm now in the 4th turn where they send 6 CRs at me and I loose nothing and kill them all. Slowly I'm wearing their CR reserves down and will be assaulting the planet :) :)

I will now in the future keep in mind how awesome the DR is if they have CRs and up :twisted:

But I want to know if things like micro fusion speed and/or a Fire Control section will make them even more deadly :twisted: I will prolly do an upgrade with reflective if they use a lot of lasers but for now I'm happy. I do know that if the get better armor the missiles will start bouncing off, but hopefully I still have some time :) I'm also wondering how they do with planet bombardment but that I should be able to find on the wiki.
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ZedF » Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:28 pm

Micro-fusion will not help DF racks. Fire control would help some, but their accuracy will still suffer due to slow shot speed. You might be better off just getting a tougher command and just expecting to need to get in close, until you can manage some higher-tech weapons.

Alternatively you can always try BB/Blazer, Liir get some pretty decent ones. They are pretty expensive though.
Zed's TARs (sample):
Fractious Allies -- Hiver vs. Hiver, with allies
Who Let The Bugs Out -- Hiver vs. Tarka and Zuul
Tarka Ascendant -- Tarka vs. Hiver and Zuul

Strategy & Tactics Forum Archive -- More posts on strategy, tactics, and TARs

ForceUser
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ForceUser » Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:42 am

Yup, the whole expensive thing is the problem since I'm so used to my rockin econ with the bugs and tarka. I''m having trouble getting any ships built, even colonizers and a war this early is new for me too. I usually have at least AP or Beams with HCLs. The lack of APs sucked (used to them) and I feel I can't afford to get weapons rather than as many econ techs as I can.

If the DF/Torp combo wasn't as awesome as it was I would prolly have gotten some other tech but this is working out pretty good. I don't even have problems with the command section blowing up yet.

AP is seen as very good because there's few techs and they last very long and some of the tech is stuff you would get anyway (duality tech). But I think DF Racks is even MORE so. Fusion warheads is awesome because it improves both your offense AND defense with sats (I like using sats) while with Drivers you need AP that doesn't really do much except make Drivers awesome :P VRF is something you research anyways.

I think I'll use DFs more because now I have a good excuse to get those warhead upgrades and not feel too guilty about it :)

Now for DN tech and darkening the skies with DFs :twisted:
Perspective Man: Much like common sense, it's so rare it's a gorram superpower.
Agent.nihilist wrote:Ooo! Whats the gesture for ramming!?
Korgan wrote:probably a pelvic thrust
Mecron wrote:oy that is wrong at so many levels...well done! :P

Torezu
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Torezu » Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:01 pm

The drawbacks to DF's:
1.) Armor can deflect them, and commonly will if the target has Magnoceramics or above.
2.) You need warhead upgrades to use them effectively. Since you're going to want those anyway, not a huge issue, but something to note.
3.) They're short range. A fleet with AP drivers, heavy energy cannons, missiles, torps, or other long-range munitions in numbers will beat up on you unless you can close range pretty quickly. As Liir, that's not always an option, especially when defending/attacking at a planet.
4.) They're not high-accuracy weapons. "Darkening the skies" will produce a good bit of damage, but as Liir, you (almost always) have access to 100% (or near) accuracy short-range weapons like Phasers, Emitters, and such.

On the other hand, it is a lot of fun to watch AM-fired DF swarms obliterate a CR fleet in seconds... :twisted:

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Red Spot
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Red Spot » Tue Aug 02, 2011 4:58 pm

Torezu wrote:On the other hand, it is a lot of fun to watch AM-fired DF swarms obliterate a CR fleet in seconds... :twisted:



The AI can use them as well .... ahem ... :roll:

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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Torezu » Tue Aug 02, 2011 5:59 pm

The eye roll was for...? The only AI's I've ever seen using DF racks are Zuul and occasionally, Hiver or Tarka. Usually, they don't have the warhead upgrades or something else (tactical sense, speed, etc.) to use them effectively. I did run into a Zuul once that packed DN's full of the things. The only thing I could fight them with was other DN's (I had to research them still), since I didn't have great armor and the amount of damage I could put out with CR's wasn't enough to kill the Zuul DN's before I got run over by the darkened sky.

On an unrelated note, I think DF racks actually reduce the number of armor points a ship has. Not by much, but every bit can count...

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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ZedF » Tue Aug 02, 2011 8:05 pm

Considering you're not only directly reducing structural integrity, you're also reducing the number of mounts that can potentially add 4-5x the structural integrity points that DF racks remove... yeah it can add up quickly. ;)
Zed's TARs (sample):
Fractious Allies -- Hiver vs. Hiver, with allies
Who Let The Bugs Out -- Hiver vs. Tarka and Zuul
Tarka Ascendant -- Tarka vs. Hiver and Zuul

Strategy & Tactics Forum Archive -- More posts on strategy, tactics, and TARs

ForceUser
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ForceUser » Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:50 pm

Heh well I had another 3v5 fight and I noticed with a little bit of creative movement (easy with liir) sometimes ALL 10 missiles hit. And in the large mount if both turrets hit that's near 35-700 damage every 15sec (12 with VFR) and you are almost guaranteed that some will hit. Fusion cannon, if it hits, if at effective range (not knife fight range the DFs like) in a large mounts do 250-500 damage

But with Fire control I'm sure the fusion cannons will kick ass either way.

BUT if I had access to AP rounds I'd go that almost instantly. Range, Accuracy, Damage, Upgrade-ability without redesign.

I'm very sure they will become outdated but they are sooooo much better and faster to get in my situation than anything else :) So somewhat situational but by no means sub-par!
Perspective Man: Much like common sense, it's so rare it's a gorram superpower.
Agent.nihilist wrote:Ooo! Whats the gesture for ramming!?
Korgan wrote:probably a pelvic thrust
Mecron wrote:oy that is wrong at so many levels...well done! :P

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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by ZedF » Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:25 pm

:thumbsup:
Zed's TARs (sample):
Fractious Allies -- Hiver vs. Hiver, with allies
Who Let The Bugs Out -- Hiver vs. Tarka and Zuul
Tarka Ascendant -- Tarka vs. Hiver and Zuul

Strategy & Tactics Forum Archive -- More posts on strategy, tactics, and TARs

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Red Spot
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Red Spot » Wed Aug 03, 2011 10:27 pm

Torezu wrote:The eye roll was for...?


Fighting the Zuul and finding your own DF-ships being borded and slaughtering your own fleet ... :roll:
:thumbsup:

Torezu
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Torezu » Wed Aug 03, 2011 10:33 pm

Or, almost as bad, having the boarding pods attach to your ships and your other ships open up on them with DF racks trying to get the boarding pods off. :shock:

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Dafmeister
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Re: Guided Ordinance (missiles and torpedos)

Post by Dafmeister » Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:50 am

A quick question regarding detonating torpedos, as I'm contemplating using torpedo destroyers with them as planetary defence ships.

Say you fire five detonating torpedos at a target. This being the 'real' world, they won't all hit simultaneously, which means the second torpedo to arrive (at least) will almost certainly be inside the blast radius when the first goes off. Will the torpedo take damage from the explosion?
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