Province Editing and No beggining Province

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djfinex
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Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by djfinex » Sun Mar 09, 2014 5:26 pm

I posted this in the Political Science tech thread, but I think it merits as a suggestion.

Province Editing please - "Redistricting" (name for the tech perhaps?), should be possible; a "province" is an abstract concept and should not be cast in stone. Redrawing internal borders should be a relatively easy task, though not effortless, for an empire that can build FTL ships, build space stations, and have command of the atom and below.

It would be nice to be able to incorporate new systems as biotech improves and those high hazard worlds are tamed in the mid to late game. Also - in the beginning, at turn 0, I don't think you should even have a province, because you only have three systems, and no empire, but that is just my humble opinion; you could even make "provinces" as a first tech for the Political Science tech tree branch.
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marshb
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by marshb » Sun Mar 09, 2014 6:41 pm

Your suggestion is definitely a popular one as it has been put forth numerous times. Question. What do you think about the current kerfufle in the Crimea? :angel:
Just kidding. Sort of. :P
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Aranador
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Aranador » Sun Mar 09, 2014 11:45 pm

The standard answer to this commonly posed question is basically as follows.

You want to do this, but your billions of people do not. When you attempt to pull the 'I am the supreme ruler' card, they play the 'popular rebellion card' and you are quietly disposed of, and your successor vows to not do the same thing.

It is a similar reason as to why you can not ram your star ship into others in Star Fleet Battles - you might want to, your crew does not.


It is ultimately irrelevant to if this can or can not be done in 'real life' for both examples - this is a game universe and while it may have similarities to real world, it also has differences.


However - the more often this thread pops up - the more often Mecron must again read it - and perhaps the squeaky wheel will get the grease. Or the shotgun.

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VikingDream
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by VikingDream » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:44 pm

I would like to see this added as some point, would be nice to be able to redrawn them or add more systems to them at some point, in much the same way lines are redrawn on maps =P
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Mecron
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Mecron » Fri Mar 14, 2014 6:28 pm

Something that happens very rarely in real life internally to a country. Developed nations have a intensely drawn out system when it comes to redrawing county or civic lines a few miles long. Provincial redraws are rare and even more rare when you edit out the ones that are simply chopping a territory in half.

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WOEaintME
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by WOEaintME » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:14 pm

Is it possible to add systems to your existing provinces? I haven't played too much so far and I'm curious if I have a 3 planet province and get the 4 planets per province tech whether or not I can simply add to my existing province. If not, then I vote for this as not having it makes the tech semi pointless.

If you don't think it's feasible then I would like to bring up the example of Israel having no difficulties swallowing up parts of its neighbours (others disagree but the Tarka probably disagree with my Leviathan smashing their worlds before I colonize them). Russia is preparing to do the same.

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Aranador
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Aranador » Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:52 am

Conquest or annexing of other nations is rather different.

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WOEaintME
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by WOEaintME » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:33 pm

And there is a fair amount of conquest in SOTS so I don't see how the "it's rare in real life" comes into play. It's also a game and I personally feel that gameplay > real life unless it's a sim (flight sim, racing sim, etc.) which SOTS is not.

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Mecron
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Mecron » Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:43 pm

one's own opinions is not carte blanche to disrespect/dismiss other's...play nice.

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Resok
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Resok » Mon Mar 17, 2014 9:46 pm

As a contrasting opinion, I find the restriction essentially makes forming galactic provinces a more meaningful choice.

Do I wait for a specific technology first before forming this province or do I need one immediately for the various benefits?

Overall I find the most major gameplay benefit of the provinces in most of my games to be the extra morale gains, and extra GDP generation. Those two items generally aren't life or death to your empire, though lack of morale can be in many cases (with a side effect of positive morale increasing your potential for increased tax income).

Either way not being able to change them does increase the pressure to either form optimal provinces while planning for future provinces, or simply forming provinces quickly to get the benefits immediately rather than later (even if they're sub-optimal). Generally I favor the second one if I'm under pressure from the enemy and need those benefits, but often stick with the first one if I have time and breathing room (which is seldom the case).

There are simply many scenarios where the system distances and climate/planet availability will *never* allow for good province layouts with default (or even in some case advanced political tech investment).
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Pavane
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Re: Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by Pavane » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:47 pm

I agree with Resok. Forcing players to make realistic strategic decisions is the sign of a good game, especially when there are pros and cons to balance. Allowing players to reallocate political boundaries at will just to maximise trade income has little foundation in our history, so proposing that this will not longer be the case in the future is the greater leap of faith. Providing static provincial boundaries is a justifiable design decision, and the alternative would result in a less challenging game.
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zanzibar196
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Province Editing and No beggining Province

Post by zanzibar196 » Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:52 pm

I still think it might be a good idea to allow the player to choose when to form the first province, and what systems to include.


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