Command, Control and Communication Technology

Research and Development in SotS2.
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Mecron
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Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by Mecron » Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:30 pm

Your place to post questions, observations and comments on C3 techs and their tree in Sword of the Stars II.

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adecoy95
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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by adecoy95 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:52 am

now that everyone starts in the fusion era, that likely means faster than light communication is quite common. will that mean tech that does not require command ships to be in the fight at all? say, a command station orbiting a planet relaying orders to an entire sector?

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by Setokaiva » Wed Apr 20, 2011 5:00 am

That sounds plausible. I'm not even going to try and argue, because I know my limits; I suck at math and know zilch about the speed of light etc. A command station should be able to collect & collate combat data and pass along orders to local defense forces. It's something I would really like to see actually, 'cause one thing I hate is having to build a CNC ship at all my worlds, then set a formation just so it doesn't get targeted by missile storms or eaten alive by Swarms/Von Neumann/etc. Individual direct action fleets should still have command ships with them; it's usually better to let local commanders handle the split-second tactical decisions without constant choreography from the system's Command Station.
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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by ZedF » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:24 am

The SotS races have all had FTL communication as of the start of every SotS1 game; fusion not required. I really doubt we will see too much deviation from the idea that a command ship must be present to fight a fleet. A station covering a star system? Perhaps... but not an entire province. You'll need mobile CnCs for that.
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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by Azrael Ultima » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:37 am

Or you could just consider CnC ships as a sort of relay station, with the rest of the fleet not so easily capable of transmitting and receiving the amount of data neccessary, if that makes you feel better.

Given that they still exist, we probably won't get by without one unless you completely overpower your enemy. Which would probably a LV vs. CR scenario, and since LVs are always CnCs anyway...
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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by Mecron » Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:00 pm

Do you think tactical battle are controlled by the pentagon here on earth? (though drone enthusiasts and tom clancy like this idea I suppose.)

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by adecoy95 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:23 pm

Mecron wrote:Do you think tactical battle are controlled by the pentagon here on earth? (though drone enthusiasts and tom clancy like this idea I suppose.)


no, but the big decisions happen there, leave the details of the battles to the squad commanders, i have a empire to run! :P

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by mattosika » Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:15 am

adecoy95 wrote:no, but the big decisions happen there, leave the details of the battles to the squad commanders, i have a empire to run! :P


Going with that line of thinking why have tactical combat at all? You wouldn't be controlling it. You have an empire to run. :P

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by adecoy95 » Thu Apr 21, 2011 4:45 am

Mecron wrote:Do you think tactical battle are controlled by the pentagon here on earth? (though drone enthusiasts and tom clancy like this idea I suppose.)


no but i would imagine troop placement and logistics would be, which is pretty much what command ships in sots 1 did. ensuring ships would be in the right place to intercept the enemy, thus giving you more ships.

unless im mistaken.

in today's warring, at least from how i understand it, you got the pentagon issuing the war decs and things like that (your homeworld), then you have the generals placing the troops onto the battlefield and managing logistics (the command center for the sector), and then you have to individual squads on the front lines themselves, managing things like not getting killed and carrying out orders from the previous two.

im not saying there wont be ships that lead in a battle, i am just saying i would not be surprised if there was tech that allowed CNC to be used from outside weapons range.

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by mattosika » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:41 am

The Pentagon really doesn't have much to do with "tactical combat" though. They focus on things from a far more strategic level. They don't really concern themselves with the actual troops that are involved.

A good example would be like the American Marines during WWII on Guadalcanal. The operation called for naval transports to unload their supplies after they dropped the troops but they ended up leaving before getting more than a little over half the supplies on the island because the group's commander felt there was too great of threat from Japanese attack, even though they left before that due to fear of reprisal from the US carrier fleet for attacks from earlier that day. The US Carrier fleet had like wise withdrawn earlier for fear of attack. My point is the leader of a fleet is always going to have far greater outcome on a battle than a centralized command staff thousands(or in SotS's case millions) of years away.

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by kdonovan » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:13 pm

There has been a very great tendency to micromanage faraway military operations but the too political leadership. This is particularly true when there are delicate political outcomes being pursued. Pres. Johnson in the White House basement plotting bombing raids in Vietnam in coordination with negotiations is a well known example.

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by White Raven » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:17 pm

kdonovan wrote:There has been a very great tendency to micromanage faraway military operations but the too political leadership. This is particularly true when there are delicate political outcomes being pursued. Pres. Johnson in the White House basement plotting bombing raids in Vietnam in coordination with negotiations is a well known example.


yeah, and that turned out sooo WELL...

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Mecron
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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by Mecron » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:21 pm

for the record...ordering a raid is NOT tactical micromanagement. That is a corp/division level response so at best he was intruding around the general level. At no point was he ordering pilots what valley to fly down. Its only now we have the tech to actually say ok 2 planes go left, 3 planes go right from the safety of a bunker somewhere...and it has proven to be dubious at best. Right now and for the foreseeable sane future, tactical manouvering is an on site command issue. In sots terms, in the same star system.

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by mattosika » Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:30 pm

It's important to consider that kind of level of command would require instant communication and FTL communications doesn't mean instantaneous. At 1.01% of light speed it would still take almost a year for your message to travel a light year, and most systems are 3-7 lys from each other in SotS. I've always assumed while data movement is fast, it still would require a day or two at least to get a message where it was going. Even a transmission lag time of 5 minutes would make something like this impossible outside of a solar system.


edit; actually Mecron, as a side note I've always wondered what one turn "equals" in terms of times. I've personally always thought of a turn a month but is there an actual answer?

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Re: Command, Control and Communication Technology

Post by EntropyAvatar » Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:44 pm

Can we expect that the techs in SotS1 that make the tactical UI more functional are already researched in SotS2? Are there going to be more techs in SotS2 that unlock UI capabilities?

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