Shield Technology

Research and Development in SotS2.
Post Reply
User avatar
Mecron
Kerberos
Posts: 38104
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:26 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Mecron » Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:28 pm

The tech that allows a meson disrupting curvature to be placed around a ship is very close to the tech that allows the same to be done with a grav field.

User avatar
Jack Trades
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Jack Trades » Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:07 am

Mecron wrote:The tech that allows a meson disrupting curvature to be placed around a ship is very close to the tech that allows the same to be done with a grav field.


What exactly does that supposed to mean? :?

That Grav and Meshon Shields are side-grades to each other? Then why does the Grav Shield come after Meson Shield in the tech tree?

User avatar
Starknight
Posts: 650
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:31 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Starknight » Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:57 am

Jack Trades wrote:
Mecron wrote:The tech that allows a meson disrupting curvature to be placed around a ship is very close to the tech that allows the same to be done with a grav field.


What exactly does that supposed to mean? :?

That Grav and Meshon Shields are side-grades to each other? Then why does the Grav Shield come after Meson Shield in the tech tree?


At a guess, it's a refinement of the Grav Shield technique to affect mesons - it's easier to affect gross molecular structure, or even individual baryons, than it is to affect the smaller mesons.
My Morrigi fleet-speed calculator for SotS Prime
The Holy Lands - Hivers vs. the infidel Liir (and others)
Currently working on getting my board game Dragon Raiders into final condition before going to Kickstarter...

Enjelus
Posts: 168
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:51 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Enjelus » Thu May 03, 2012 6:41 pm

Pai wrote:What the heck is this, inverse cube law, i see that keeps poping up in the thread?


It's called a plot device.

Really if you look the way shields were used on DE's and CR's in prime its fairly evident they are following the inverse square law, if they actually followed the inverse cube law you wouldn't be able to use them on CR's without having pretty dramatic drawbacks over DE's shields.

User avatar
Mecron
Kerberos
Posts: 38104
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:26 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Mecron » Thu May 03, 2012 9:55 pm

:roll:

User avatar
Starknight
Posts: 650
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:31 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Starknight » Thu May 03, 2012 10:00 pm

Enjelus wrote:
Pai wrote:What the heck is this, inverse cube law, i see that keeps poping up in the thread?


It's called a plot device.

Really if you look the way shields were used on DE's and CR's in prime its fairly evident they are following the inverse square law, if they actually followed the inverse cube law you wouldn't be able to use them on CR's without having pretty dramatic drawbacks over DE's shields.


I suspect it's not just as simple as the inverse cube law, but also a threshold effect that's holding them back from being used on DNs as well; once you hit a certain point, your efficiency drops sharply and more power in equals significantly less power back out. CRs fall under the threshold, but probably not too far under it.
My Morrigi fleet-speed calculator for SotS Prime
The Holy Lands - Hivers vs. the infidel Liir (and others)
Currently working on getting my board game Dragon Raiders into final condition before going to Kickstarter...

User avatar
Agent.nihilist
Posts: 1016
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:57 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Agent.nihilist » Thu May 03, 2012 10:59 pm

Enjelus wrote:
Pai wrote:What the heck is this, inverse cube law, i see that keeps poping up in the thread?


It's called a plot device.

Really if you look the way shields were used on DE's and CR's in prime its fairly evident they are following the inverse square law, if they actually followed the inverse cube law you wouldn't be able to use them on CR's without having pretty dramatic drawbacks over DE's shields.

Like having the same mitigation values despite being powered by a much larger engine?
Will the Great wrote:Well, that's probably why you're having a difficult time. Because you made the game more difficult.

Ishantil wrote:BIRD RUSH KEKEKEKEKE

Don't mind me, I'm unreasonably reasonable :twisted:

Enjelus
Posts: 168
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:51 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Enjelus » Sat May 12, 2012 11:10 pm

Agent.nihilist wrote:
Enjelus wrote:
Pai wrote:What the heck is this, inverse cube law, i see that keeps poping up in the thread?


It's called a plot device.

Really if you look the way shields were used on DE's and CR's in prime its fairly evident they are following the inverse square law, if they actually followed the inverse cube law you wouldn't be able to use them on CR's without having pretty dramatic drawbacks over DE's shields.

Like having the same mitigation values despite being powered by a much larger engine?


Same?

User avatar
Jack Trades
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Jack Trades » Sun May 13, 2012 4:38 pm

Starknight wrote:
Jack Trades wrote:
Mecron wrote:The tech that allows a meson disrupting curvature to be placed around a ship is very close to the tech that allows the same to be done with a grav field.


What exactly does that supposed to mean? :?

That Grav and Meshon Shields are side-grades to each other? Then why does the Grav Shield come after Meson Shield in the tech tree?


At a guess, it's a refinement of the Grav Shield technique to affect mesons - it's easier to affect gross molecular structure, or even individual baryons, than it is to affect the smaller mesons.


That still doesn't make any sense from gameplay perspective whatsoever. Why are Ballistic Weapons are at a disadvantage here by being able to be negated by shield users completely, earlier in the game than Energy Weapons?
Or if you look at it from another perspective. Why does Shield users have a disadvantage against energy users by having to research an extra late-game technology to be able to counter them?

Is it because "I say so"?

User avatar
usermist2
Posts: 1449
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:31 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by usermist2 » Tue May 15, 2012 8:54 am

Because it's easier to deflect physical objects than energy particles. :roll:
Image

Things Go Better With C2H5OH.

User avatar
Agent.nihilist
Posts: 1016
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:57 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Agent.nihilist » Tue May 15, 2012 8:00 pm

Looks like I'm wrong on the shield strength, CRs have a multiplier effect to the absorption level of the shield.
As for Grav Vs Meson, The scientist in me says its easier to make a net to catch a football than a Atom, and sense disruptor and deflector shields exist early on the method is known; the remainder of the work is fine tuning.

Game play wise, it much easier to get a devastating ballistics weapon than it is an energy based one.
Will the Great wrote:Well, that's probably why you're having a difficult time. Because you made the game more difficult.

Ishantil wrote:BIRD RUSH KEKEKEKEKE

Don't mind me, I'm unreasonably reasonable :twisted:

User avatar
Rage-Overkill
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:39 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Rage-Overkill » Tue May 15, 2012 8:49 pm

Mecron wrote:I have a very precise and personal sense of things I find so dumb it makes my brain hurt...one of those is bad SF that makes volume energy effects have no relationship to size.


Now that is a potentially realistic argument however would it not be more energy efficient to have smaller generators located in key points to create a interlocking group of shields that would be individually powered. You may have seen me argue this before or state it but I think ill reiterate it here. If you have several small nodes each projecting a mid sized shield area over a potion of a ship and another in another are and they are close enough to interlock then you could potentially create a shell around a ship. This would require a hard point per projector and since smaller projectors require less power this would mean that this system could be possible. It would do two things to a dreadnaught however A) it would eat up medium weapon hard points on the ship which would reduce its firepower, and B) would make the ship unsuitable to using energy weapons in combat (which are more accurate) and force the ship to rely on projectile weapons otherwise there would be a power conflict. The other reason I am sure that the whole shield dreadnaught thing is being avoided is that it could be easily exploited by using the energy absorbers which could in turn keep a shield of that nature at full power rather than power beam weapons if the ship was not using them.

While shielding a Dreadnaught would be brilliant fun to accomplish it would be a engineering nightmare and difficult to fix once broken. Despite the inverse cube law which as educated as I am, I am sadly not fully aware of I think it is possible to shield a Dreadnaught class vessel, but it is however rather not very efficient.

What would be far more efficient would be Nanobots to repair hull damage so that each ship that your fleet either blows up or looses can go to repair your armor as the nanobots could make use of the materials by breaking them down to base components so on and so forth.
I am the ghost in your machine

User avatar
Agent.nihilist
Posts: 1016
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:57 am

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Agent.nihilist » Tue May 15, 2012 10:08 pm

Part of what Mec generally seems to be getting at, is the way shields are done in Sots, the tech cannot scale indefinitely. The Sotsverse races need to figure out a different way to shield larger vessels, and they haven't worked that out yet. But they might, over the next 2 expansions work out a solution :twisted:
Will the Great wrote:Well, that's probably why you're having a difficult time. Because you made the game more difficult.

Ishantil wrote:BIRD RUSH KEKEKEKEKE

Don't mind me, I'm unreasonably reasonable :twisted:

User avatar
Rage-Overkill
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:39 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Rage-Overkill » Tue May 15, 2012 11:10 pm

Agent.nihilist wrote:Part of what Mec generally seems to be getting at, is the way shields are done in Sots, the tech cannot scale indefinitely. The Sotsverse races need to figure out a different way to shield larger vessels, and they haven't worked that out yet. But they might, over the next 2 expansions work out a solution :twisted:



And thus my solution to the problem lol I figured it out for them lol.
I am the ghost in your machine

User avatar
Nspace
Kerbicron Cleric
Kerbicron Cleric
Posts: 4656
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 7:26 pm

Re: Shield Technology

Post by Nspace » Tue May 15, 2012 11:23 pm

Rage-Overkill wrote:a hard point per projector ... it would eat up medium weapon hard points on the ship which would reduce its firepower

So... Shield Projectors? :P :lol:

Seriously though, I wouldn't be totally surprised if we eventually see shield modules or drone constellations that produce smaller areas of shielding for large craft.
"Quando omni flunkus, mortati" - "When all else fails, play dead"
SotS 1 wiki: http://wiki.swordofthestars.com/sots1/Main_Page
SotS 2 wiki: http://wiki.swordofthestars.com/sots2/SotS2_Codex

Post Reply

Return to “The Tech”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests