Hiver Units

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Nall White
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Hiver Units

Post by Nall White » Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:29 pm

Someone on the spacebattles forum brought up an interesting point.

Ground Pounders just isn't my kind of game. I really like that they involved orbital supremacy into the system, but, over all, something I can't nail down feels off about the game as presented.

Shouldn't the Hivers use giant soldiers instead of tanks? Everything I recall about them points to that being the case. Or, at least a giant bug with a cyborg cannon implant would be cool.


The timeline of the game wouldn't support cybernetic weapons. But, Hiver warriors with exo-suits with mounted weapons would be nice.
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Mecron
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Mecron » Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:39 pm

Well first it's important I realize that GP units represent hundreds of dudes, not just one rts unit.

HIVER infantry IS composed of the troopers you have seen n the sotsverse so far, just like human players can work their way up to armoured infantry equipped with brawler suits ;)

And I know it's may be strange fir some folks but the sotsverse is a relatively are SF universe and GP reflects that. Hivers are awesome but the physics to let one one take a hit from a neutronium laced driver round doing about Mach 10 just doesn't add up. We can just bend the rules enough to imagine that many centimetres of exotic composite armours and a forcefield or two might let another tank survive that :P

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BlueTemplar
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by BlueTemplar » Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:34 pm

I don't know why, this discussion made me think of this :
Image
(especially about the HUGE walker in the Zuul background...)
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Mecron
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Mecron » Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:38 pm

By huge walker do you mean "tank" for all Intents a purposes? ;)

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BlueTemplar
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by BlueTemplar » Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:00 pm

Oh, no, this one looks like it could crush a tank by merely stepping on it, and that cannon can probably sink an aircraft carrier in one hit... :shock:

Also, it reminds me of the Zuul drone designs, though those are much smaller.

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Major Diarrhia
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Major Diarrhia » Mon Sep 09, 2013 7:21 am

If you can have a giant walking robot as armored as a tank, I don't see why you can't have a giant walking bug as armored as a tank. :) It was recently reported that DNA has been used to self assemble carbon semiconductors; as far as I'm concerned, someday I'll live in an orbital tree, and fly around in a space whale, both of which have grown nanotube and graphene skin and bones, while my ass stores self grown carbon computers to augment my brain. No more sitting at the computer, I can now sit on it. [fonzy]Eeeeh.[/fonzy]

It would actually be a bit more interesting for only humans to have tanks, given that the first World War was a rather unique situation. It wouldn't be out of the question for no one else to have had the pressure to develop extremely heavily armored, mobile direct fire artillery, to traverse otherwise impenetrable defenses, and overcome lack of communications by brute force. Everyone else could have very heavy wheeled, or legged, vehicles, or creatures; those would by necessity have a lower maximum tonnage with high or lower speed. However, tracks are pretty simple, and even if you just see them without touching them, I wouldn't be surprised at the Tarka going, duh, and whipping out their own refined tank design in a year, vaguely like the Japanese with guns after the Dutch introduced them. For the Hivers, a giant armored snail (so damn silly) slower than anything else, but still fast enough, and with the highest possible tonnage.

Okay, that's too much, other than the obvious time sink it would be to make every faction unique to that degree. I don't seriously think any of this will be done, but I'm having fun, and I'm on a roll, so I'll keep the spiel going.

  • Liir: just ever larger cetaceans with awesome mind powers, giving a very direct, bigger is better.
  • Morrigi: everything either flies, jumps, or is air droppable, and is therefore very light, or they start with antigravity which I don't think would be as interesting, but which may be more correct. They would use lots of automated scout drones.
  • Zuul: fairly conventional, but with baby swarms, and maybe a ground based node weapon would be fun. Maybe they're orbital support is a little sloppy? Maybe those babies would have cameras implanted in them to act as scouts?
  • And the new guys, the Loa (I know they don't fit the time frame, right?): I want to say they just grey goo everything, cause you know they want to, or that they would have a unit analog of everything out there, but both sound wrong since they're so obvious. I think they would go really small, and widely swarming, ie swarm of explosive butterflies, precision orbital artillery instead of ground artillery, and fixed position, high range, relays as commanders with very high command/support range. Something like that, something which places them more in orbit, using absolute finesse, and standing off completely out of real danger. Maybe they get more and better cards for orbital support.

Good luck.
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Sayeth
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Sayeth » Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:26 am

It actually makes a lot of sense for all the races to have tanks and artillery given their history.

Humans - well duh.
Tarka - Constant politics and wars over influence and power, not to mention being close to humans so they can learn and copy some weapon schematics from them
Hivers - Basically the same, although they have been through the bloodiest conflict out of all, basically being in a constant state of war up until recently.

Given the fact that all three races have been warring actively, researching better and stronger weapons and armor makes sense, having a vehicle that will easily roll over your enemies is thus a dream they all must have pursued. Artillery also always makes sense - If enemy sits tight in a large impenetrable fortress, the best way to take it down is from a distance.

In regards to other races - Mecron claimed that the game will span across different time periods.

Liir/Zuul - there will be a need for ground combat to preserve innocent lives and they are good at cooking up new (and devious) things
Morrigi - Drones and lazorz?
Loa - Why would they want to fight on the ground when they kind of prefer destroying all life?
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Major Diarrhia
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Major Diarrhia » Fri Sep 13, 2013 4:47 am

I just figured out a Zuul concept, like a combination of the Chinese human wave myth, and their modern load out for soldiers, with some weirdness thrown in. The only Zuul ground vehicles are APC's and self propelled guns. Zuul themselves are armed with either an anti-material rifle, or automatic grenade launcher, or light machine gun, or, as the vast majority get, an anti-air -vehicle rocket launcher and carbine. There are also the psychic powers.

Their mobile artillery is extremely fast firing, fast moving, very accurate, and can hit aerial targets (though poorly).

Their tactics revolve around an overwhelming set of artillery barrages, which are quickly followed up by mechanized charges at weak points. Combat consists of overwhelming numbers of very heavily armed foot soldiers. The over all principle is to constantly be on the move, and exploit every weakness.

They would also have a natural foraging bonus.

Even more now, I like the idea of the Tarka having no tanks. I could even see them not accepting tanks simply out of tradition, or political infighting. Though a real warrior society wouldn't let that stuff get in the way of a good weapon.

Sayeth wrote:Loa - Why would they want to fight on the ground when they kind of prefer destroying all life?

I can actually see the Loa needing a conventional force of some sort for defending their worlds from ground invasion, so they don't have to glass or goo their own populations.
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Ludovsky
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Re: Hiver Units

Post by Ludovsky » Fri Sep 13, 2013 6:43 am

Sayeth wrote:It actually makes a lot of sense for all the races to have tanks and artillery given their history.
Loa - Why would they want to fight on the ground when they kind of prefer destroying all life?


If Loa are ever added somehow, recall another reason they might be added in ground combat is that they're good at torching the surface of planets from fall, but let's not forget about troops which may have retreated in underground shelters and hold-out to wait off the planetary bombing phase. You can't occupy a planet if you have enemies running hit and runs from locations buried deep enough you cannot completely eradicate them. There's only so much you could see/destroy from space, I feel.

Much like today's air superiority. A airplane might own enemy troops in sight or a tank in the open, but bring them in a city and it's another matter altogether. At the end of the day we still need boots on the ground to capture cities/infracstructure/etc and make sure we haven't forgoten anyone who may contest the claim..

This said, the subject is Hivers units last I checked, so disregard my post.

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