Do you like the mission system?

Talk about all things to do with the sequel to our flagship 4X title.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Jorgen_CAB » Mon May 14, 2012 6:01 pm

I like most part of it. The only thing which I miss is a good way to move ships in reserve from one base to another without having to create a fleet. But I think it has been said from the developer that we should be able to do that once all features is there, if I'm not mistaken.

I like the fact that you send fleets on actual missions and have them return to base afterwards. The developers has also said there will be some expanded feature to help with some tasks. Such as the possibility to re-base a fleet to a different base after a mission and being able to being sent on another mission without returning to base using an admirals reaction skill.

All in all I like the mission system quite allot.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Simetra » Mon May 14, 2012 6:02 pm

I like the system.

Here and there some tweaks could come in handy (but we know some are underway so ;)).

No need to change it :)

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by qwsed » Mon May 14, 2012 6:09 pm

I cant stand it personally :( It hammers gameplay and greatly.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by zaknafein » Mon May 14, 2012 6:10 pm

I like the system. Once you get the logic behind it, work very well :)

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Mugabi » Mon May 14, 2012 6:19 pm

I think the mission system only need some sort of queue for similar missions, like if you're gonna survey 4 systems at once. Other than that, it helps a lot tracking fleets movements, no need to go from planet to planet looking for that fleet you sent to do something and after a couple of turns you forgot where...
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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Unthinking_Pain » Mon May 14, 2012 6:19 pm

I like the concept and overall reason for the mission system, as well as what it allows me to do.

I do not like the UI for handling the fleet assignment for a mission. First, like many UIs in the game, there is not enough intelligent filtering done/available (like only colony ships for colonization/support, only fleet with constructors for constructino, and hell let us designate fleets with a role and then have it so we can select that role on the fleet assignment list). Too much pretty stuff like multi-colored rings and what not that don't really accomplish anything. In fact, in the fleet assignment section, the galaxy display would be a whole lot more useful if all the systems were just homogenous dots, with the target being significantly brighter. Then, when I select a fleet, the fleet's current location could also "brighten" up. A few relevant details like distance separating target and the current fleet would update (as well as the current mission time parameters). I guess Sol/Zu'ul need the nodeline, too.

I do not like that I can't start the mission selection from a fleet (which would be in addition to the option to starting it from a target). I would very much like it if I could go to Colony Fleet 1, right-click, select Run Colonization mission, and a sortable list of colonizable planets that are in range came up. The list should be sortable by at least Climate Hazard and travel distance, and their should be information about any other colonies I already have in the same system.
Last edited by Unthinking_Pain on Mon May 14, 2012 6:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by fallenphoenix » Mon May 14, 2012 6:20 pm

To me, SotS feels more closely related to the hardcore strategy titles (think Hearts of Iron and the like) than it is to relatively fast-paced RTS titles. I don't mind spending several minutes on a turn, and I love games that can last hundreds of turns over many weeks/months. I'm starting to feel a bit nostalgic for the old email based turn-based strategy games. :lol:

Of course, I love the mission system as an idea, and although the current implementation is frustrating at times (but still reasonably effective), I am excited and very optimistic about the end result that I think Kerberos has in mind.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Darloth » Mon May 14, 2012 6:23 pm

Sometimes I find it annoying to use, sometimes I really like the way it makes things conceptually easier, and I don't forget about fleets as often.

You contest it's unnecessary, but I don't think it would be the same game without it. It might be a more easily accessible game without it, but I don't think it would be as interesting in terms of strategic depth. Hopefully it can be made more accessible by interface improvements and other bits and pieces, without having to lose the uniqueness of such a mission system.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by BTAxis » Mon May 14, 2012 6:26 pm

I like the aspect that fleets have to return to their base periodically. I do think that shoehorning this behavior into missions is a bit restrictive. I'd have liked a more direct approach based on supply, where a fleet uses supply for carrying out any action (including sitting still) in a system without the capacity to resupply it, but the player is free to do with the fleets what he likes otherwise. That's just a random opinion though; the mission system is what we get, and I doubt it's likely to change in a big way.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Blackwarder » Mon May 14, 2012 6:30 pm

Am I the only one having a déjà vu from six months ago?


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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Seboss » Mon May 14, 2012 6:30 pm

I don't mind the new fleet system at all, and I can get behind the necessity to have a command ship for any sizeable task force. For just scouting and survey or hauling ships around, I'm not so sure. But I think the possibility to relocate without a C&C is on its way.

About the mission system per se, I think I understand the rationale behind it but it doesn't work so well for me. It feels very unnatural, which should not seem too surprising since it's pretty much the opposite of what other games usually requires the player to do. So right now, it creates a lot of friction for me. Maybe it feels a bit cumbersome in the early game, when we more or less know each Admiral and ship name by heart, but becomes much more efficient in the mid to late game. I haven't played the game enough yet. Or maybe some refinements like the possibility to queue missions and other things are planned and may help making the system more efficient.

Some people seem to love it so I guess Kerberos didn't do anything wrong with this system or innovated just for the sake of innovating, but I have very mixed feelings about it. I'm not sure it really solves any micromanagement issues, it even seems to require more management but maybe I'm doing it wrong. In any case, any improvement to streamline things would be gladly welcome :)
Last edited by Seboss on Mon May 14, 2012 6:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by fibio » Mon May 14, 2012 6:33 pm

While I initially found the mission system frustrating its getting to the point where I'm using it intuitively and actually missed it when I was playing Endless Space. It just makes so much more sense than just having fleets anywhere at any time.
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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Agent.nihilist » Mon May 14, 2012 6:35 pm

Big fan, was a little hesitant about it at first glance(when seen in teaser interviews) but loved it once I got my hands on it.
The system:
Simplifies fleet management - I can purpose name each fleet I build and build fleets to role.
Reduces micro late game - I've found managing 30 fleets in LoW easier than 10 in Prime.
No need to keep track of where fleets are located - Mission screen lists all fleets in range of target by system
No lost fleets - if its usable its listed, if it doesn't have enough range its a simple peruse through the fleet list(organized by system)
Very easy to defend borders - Patrol missions can intercept incoming fleets, even if they aren't to the same system.
Encourages more strategic play - fleets needing to rebase for fresh crew/supplies means windows of opportunity to catch systems unguarded.
Discourages cheese tactics - no more parking a ER Deepscan in deepspace for 200 years.
Creates targets of opportunity - blowing up a lvl 3-5 naval station wrecks havoc with logistics.

Overall its made fleet management much easier, and reduced micro. I can send a fleet on a 20 turn mission with 4 clicks, and only have to worry about reassigning it when it comes home.

Edit: devs have said, MANY times that:
Re-basing to a different system after a mission is coming.
Fleet based mission assignments are coming.
Sending a fleet on a second mission without re-basing is coming.(linked to reaction)
Relocating reserve ships to another system without the need to create a fleet will be implemented. (thanks Weidekuh)
Last edited by Agent.nihilist on Mon May 14, 2012 8:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Sparra » Mon May 14, 2012 6:38 pm

While I'm not a fan of the current UI for the mission system (I suppose that may change when the polishing stage hits), I do understand the logic behind it. In Prime, one could send a fleet somewhere they had NO HOPE of reaching, running out of fuel midway and being stranded there. In SotS2, I think the mission system provides a sort of "sanity check" for your fleets, as they won't voluntarily go somewhere that's outside their supply range. After all, once you run out of food/fuel, bad things tend to happen to the crew. :<

It would be interesting to see a system where some EXTREMELY loyal admirals would be willing to go on a one-way trip somewhere, at the expense of the morale of your empire (and I would think such an action would sharpy drive your gov't type up the Y-axis [authority] ). Perhaps then we'd have the best of both worlds... We could have fleets meet up with supply caravans to keep them going, but not everyone in your military are going to be willing to take such a risk.

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Re: Do you like the mission system?

Post by Seboss » Mon May 14, 2012 6:46 pm

Mugabi wrote:it helps a lot tracking fleets movements, no need to go from planet to planet looking for that fleet you sent to do something and after a couple of turns you forgot where...

Really? Well I really must be doing it wrong then because I spend an awful lot of time in the fleet manager searching for where my #!@$ fleets are, are going, or what their homebase is... I check on ETAs every single turn, when I want to build a station, I almost always pick the Construction fleet which is halfway across the galaxy instead of the one sitting two jumps from there... you get the idea.

I believe the improved news ticker is going to be a huge help here. I agree with Unthinking_pain about the visual fluff also. I think there's too much of it on the star map and it affects the readability. The pretty flashy rings, often obfuscates the useful information like fleet, station and gate icons and I often myself having to zoom in and out quite a bit. So I don't know what's planned in the UI updates, but there's any possibility for that, I'd be happy if the visual effects could be a little more discreet.


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